Vfr mod and car wheel info required

[TheBogyman]

I am for fitting a rear car wheel to the bandit with the vfr750 swinger, i am only going 6.5" wide which i think is well wide enough, and should'nt be too hard to center,,,is there anything i should know or any help on this one, which make works well with little mods, i know the rear of the wheel will have too be machined to take the disc nut heads, thats not the issue, any help on the one guys,, Thanks,,,

[Jockney Rebel]

id be interested inthis as well as i was thinking the same thing cept for a triumph swing arm ..

[WATEVR]

as we all sit and wait for ben to reply!! there should be info in either in the build threads for VENOM or Damos cbr that should be useful

[pappas]

There was a Triumph swing arm at Metro's a couple of weeks back for $800 complete with wheel. I think he's still got it.

[Pommy Chopper]

Car wheels on bikes, i Fackin love 'em!!
Done a few in rigid frames, it's the "J" that you need to look at, which is the offset of the face that bolts to the hub to the rim measurement.
Some wheels have a huge offset, some have small, so be careful or your wheel will be hanging out the side of your bike.
Also check the inside of the wheel, between the flanges of the rim, some have a huge rebate in the middle of the rim, you will struggle like fuck to get a tyre on these rims.
I know cos i have fucked off many tyre fitters trying to get a tyre on a beemer wheel!!

You'll need to get a very patient friendly fitter to put the tyre on most car rims as the bike tyre won't be happy to go on (that's my experience anyway)!

Good luck with it, get some pics up.

Cheers

[Jockney Rebel]

cheers pom mate ill keep it in mind i was just gonna use it for strip work anyway once the triples got some gas on

[Gix11]

All I know is the basics and that is that you need a 4 hole 100 PCD wheel (100mm). If you want to go all out you can get them custom made with the offset you need to make it centre on such a small wheel width. Here's where I got mine from: http://www.showwheels.com.au/wheels/showwheels_sml.php?Series=4 but you'll have something similar locally I guess (saying that, mine came from the states....) - Cheap method is to find an old Honda car wheel and it will fit perfect....

A bit like Scrapyard's CBR:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/Scrapyard49/Damage%20Control/DSC00630.jpg

[Shadowzone]

So in saying all that, how much of a migraine i it gonna be to fit my 240 rim to my vfr sssa? Is it possible?

[Pommy Chopper]

If you go 100mm PCD be fucking careful as some wheels are 102mm PCD, they look the same but the studs will bend and break if you fuck up and bolt it on!!

[TheBogyman]

quote:Originally posted by Gix11

All I know is the basics and that is that you need a 4 hole 100 PCD wheel (100mm). If you want to go all out you can get them custom made with the offset you need to make it centre on such a small wheel width. Here's where I got mine from: http://www.showwheels.com.au/wheels/showwheels_sml.php?Series=4 but you'll have something similar locally I guess (saying that, mine came from the states....) - Cheap method is to find an old Honda car wheel and it will fit perfect....

A bit like Scrapyard's CBR:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/Scrapyard49/Damage%20Control/DSC00630.jpg


im same as you si, the basic's i know, but its the offset that bothers me, how best can i get that right, and how best to measure it, any ideas on that one mate,,,

[slip]

Often on wheels the J measurement is the width. 17x7JJ for example.

Offset is often stamped onto the wheel internally, or there is a manufacturers sticker if you're lucky.

Any factory wheel is easy to find the offset for, and any aftermarket wheel will have it listed also - so doesn't matter if it's not on the wheel itself, easy to find out through a search on the net or in catalogues.

You guys need to find out how many mm, if any, difference you require between the rim face, and the centre of the wheel - and in what direction. +25 offset would mean that the rim face where the bolt holes are is 25mm towards the outside of the rim. 0 offset = dead in line. -15 offset = rim face is 15mm inwards of the centreline - so the wheels would sit a fair way out if they were on a car. It's the opposite to what you'd expect. - offset = wheels sit out further on car, + offset = sit in further.

[Slain]

most wheels have a +45 offset, especially 4x100 as they are designed for front wheel drives. if you need a rim with lower offset but want to stick with 4 stud then look at 4x114.3mm (nissan silvia, cefiro, non turbo skyline, toyota sprinter, toyota supra (ma61 model))
These are a very common wheel and you can pick up a pair for fuck all as people sell them for drift rims.

[Gix11]

quote:Originally posted by TheBogyman


quote:Originally posted by Gix11

All I know is the basics and that is that you need a 4 hole 100 PCD wheel (100mm). If you want to go all out you can get them custom made with the offset you need to make it centre on such a small wheel width. Here's where I got mine from: http://www.showwheels.com.au/wheels/showwheels_sml.php?Series=4 but you'll have something similar locally I guess (saying that, mine came from the states....) - Cheap method is to find an old Honda car wheel and it will fit perfect....



im same as you si, the basic's i know, but its the offset that bothers me, how best can i get that right, and how best to measure it, any ideas on that one mate,,,


I wish I could mate. Ben's the man to ask as he's doing mine. With an 8.5" wheel he had to offset the arm so much that the frame needed to be modified to keep the wheel centre. As for the size you are looking at, if the arm is fitted why not stand the bike up straight and draw a 6.5" wide wheel on the ground which is centred to the bike and see where the mounting point of the hub is in comparison to your drawing? Maybe this will give you an indication of which offset you will be needing?

Ben of couirse is the master and he'd know for sure. Mine was just a guess that I'd have a go at.

[slip]

You can custom order wheels in whatever offset you want too. This can be pretty cheap, or fucking expensive, depending on the company. Older BMW's which run 4x100 need that done sometimes to get good wheels and good offset. Saves hacking frames/swingarms up, just get the right offset and it should all sit perfect.

[Jockney Rebel]

thats all very well but mine hasnt got studs [wnoder if a wire wheel from a car will fit lol]

[Pommy Chopper]

quote:Originally posted by Jockney Rebel

thats all very well but mine hasnt got studs [wnoder if a wire wheel from a car will fit lol]


I could make the fucker fit JR!!:D

[Jockney Rebel]

lol big hammer time ...i go and nick a old Jag wheel and we ll get started ....

[TheBogyman]

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/13170375528846.gif


Got a bit more info, but again its basic stuff, but someone might ave a use for it,,
Wheel Backspace
This is the distance from the back edge of the wheel to the hub mounting surface. To determine the wheel backspace:
Position the wheel face down.
Lay a straight-edge across the back of the wheel.
Measure the distance from the straight-edge to the wheel’s hub mounting surface.

Wheel Offset
The wheel’s offset is the distance from its hub mounting surface to the centerline of the wheel. To determine wheel offset:
Position the wheel on a flat surface and measure its overall width.
Divide the overall width by two, then subtract this result from the backspace value.

Offset = Backspace - (Rim Width ÷ 2)

The offset of a wheel can be one of the following three settings:

Zero offset:
The hub mounting surface is even with the centerline of the wheel.

Positive offset:
The hub mounting surface is toward the front or wheel side of the wheel. Positive offset wheels are generally found on front-wheel drive cars.

Negative offset:
The hub mounting surface is toward the back or brake side of the wheel’s centerline. “Deep dish” wheels are typically negative offset.

[TheBogyman]

quote:As for the size you are looking at, if the arm is fitted why not stand the bike up straight and draw a 6.5" wide wheel on the ground which is centred to the bike and see where the mounting point of the hub is in comparison to your drawing? Maybe this will give you an indication of which offset you will be needing?


Good thinking batman,,,ill get my brain in gear this weekend, and try and sort out some deminsions,,,

[Large]

Davy,

PM EXBEN and ask for the offset needed. He did mine on the ZX10 and I remember him saying to try and get a certain offset so it would be close, then it would only need a thin spacer to fit up perfeck.

[EXBEN]

As Gix said go for the 4 x 100 stud pattern & you'll find most wheels with this pattern are in the 35-45mm offset range for front wheel drive cars. You can fit a 6.5 - 7" rim without really off setting the arm much. I replace the wheel studs with longer ARP ones, then make a 20-25mm (depending on the bike & swingarm offset) spacer to get the wheel in the right spot. To center the wheel, an easy way is to fit the new studs then pack washers on the studs to where you think & bolt the wheel on without a tyre. Then using a straight edge against the outer edges of the wheel & pointing forward, measure the distance out to an even point on the frame like the footpeg mounts then space the wheel accordingly.Measure the washer stack & make a spacer the same size.
An 8.5" rim is a different matter all together. With frame mods required to get the wheel centered.

[TheBogyman]

Thanks Ben, think we were all waiting on the master bulider replying too the thread,i've been out in the shed with straight edges and cord, so am getting a feel for the wheel fitting saga,,my bother is the car wheel is more of an after thought, as i have already fitted the swing arm too the frame,,,

[slip]

Why not just work out what offset you need and order a wheel to suit?

[TheBogyman]

not as simple as that slip, wish it was, if it was, the offset i need is 15mm, with the 100x4 wheel centers, and 6.5" wide, black center, with polished rim,:o)(hows that for a wish list,) been i touch with a few auto access shops, so there looking into it, its the rim width thats my bother, i set the swing arm in too take the standard vfr wheel, this is an after though, and dont fancy another session of taking out and machining the arm again, anything wider that 6.5 will need to be off center too clear the swing arm,listening too ben, and putting a bit of thought into it, the offset wont be a big issue as i can get a spacer made,,ill let you know how i get on on Monday, thanks for all the help guys,,,AGAIN,,,

[Slain]

you will more than likely never find a +15 4x100 rim, due to teh fact they are a fwd stud pattern.
Ben just curoious as to why you uuse 4x100? because ive been looking at running 4x114.3 on my gix.

[slip]

Bogeyman - it is that simple. Seriously. Anyone who does custom wheel orders can do that. Simmons, and a number of others.

4 x 100 is not fwd only. Older BMW's ran it, and I think some other older rwd cars too.

Any wheel guys that the classic/custom/race car guys use will do it for you no worries. I can get a list of places for you if you want.

[Gix11]

quote:Originally posted by Slain

you will more than likely never find a +15 4x100 rim, due to teh fact they are a fwd stud pattern.
Ben just curoious as to why you uuse 4x100? because ive been looking at running 4x114.3 on my gix.


114.3mm is imperial conversion for 4.5", that would be old school stuff wouldn't it?

[EXBEN]

quote:Slain Posted - 14 Dec 2008 : 11:33:11
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
you will more than likely never find a +15 4x100 rim, due to teh fact they are a fwd stud pattern.
Ben just curoious as to why you uuse 4x100? because ive been looking at running 4x114.3 on my gix.
The VFR runs this stud pattern standard so it's an easy fit.

Yes you can get a wheel made to suit but it puts more of a limit on styles. Also it can be a fair bit more expensive. Ive just done a conversion that uses a commodore pattern 5 x 120 wheel & the spacer converts from 4 - 5 stud, this still worked out cheaper than a custom wheel.

[slip]

Yeah good point Ben.

If you can get away from 4x100 it's about a million times easier to source a wheel. 4x114.3 or even better 5 stud.

If you moved to 17x7 an off the shelf car wheel becomes a far easier proposition. If you look around you'll find a number of them are made in 4x100 and 4x114.3 multifit.

[TheBogyman]

yea,, just spent the morning driving round this wet and stinking cold shit hole looking for a 6.5" wheel, 17" diameter, and can get bugger all,,,,soooo back to the drawing board we go,,,looking more like a 7" wide off the shelf wheel, and a butchering match on the swinger again,,,Ahhggg!!! Linkage for the shock has too be moved as well,,,,bugger,,,

[TheBogyman]

Ahh,,,things are looking better, just spoke too these extremely helpful guys - http://www.performancealloys.com/index.asp
and best of all there in northern ireland, and it gets better,,,,the sale guys girlfriend live's 3 miles from me, and he's bringing me down a couple of 7" wide wheels too mock up(delivered too the door), and has got me a price of £350 for a custom wheel made too y spec,,,so stay tunned for more on this one,,it dont get any better than this...

[Gix11]

http://www.performancealloys.com/results_search.asp?procedure=wheels_by_car&size=17&wheel_manufacturer=%27AEZ%27,%20%27Antera%27,%20%2 7AXE%27,%20%27BBS%27,%20%27Chrome%27,%20%27Commerc ial%20Wheels%27,%20%27Compomotive%27,%20%27Devil%2 7,%20%27Dezent%27,%20%27Dotz%27,%20%27Enkei%27,%20 %27Fox%20Off%20Road%27,%20%27Fox%20Racing%27,%20%2 7Fox%20RS%27,%20%27Hot%20deals%27,%20%27Inovit%27, %20%27KEI%20Racing%27,%20%27League%27,%20%27Lenso% 27,%20%27MOMO%27,%20%27MSW%20by%20OZ%20Racing%27,% 20%27MVK%27,%20%27O.Z%20Racing%27,%20%27PA%20Racin g%27,%20%27Samurai%27,%20%27Speedline%27,%20%27Zit o%27&page=2&permission=859514286

You've got shit loads to choose from. These look ok if they'll do the 4 hole:

http://www.performancealloys.com/images/products/wheels/large/momocorseblack.jpg

[TheBogyman]

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/75849908361661.jpg

Lad from the shop just left, and we looked at the options with the7" wheel, and its just way too far off center, so i am going too order a custom wheel, £320 no spacers to machine, no studs to extend, and choice of style,,,,more too follow,,,

[TheBogyman]

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/758499083171070.jpg


Took a quick snap with my mobile,,cant wait too get the wheel sorted and the exhaust finished, i intend too build her up, and check out the engine before moding the tank and switch gear,,

[TheBogyman]

quote:You've got shit loads to choose from. These look ok if they'll do the 4 hole:

http://www.performancealloys.com/images/products/wheels/large/momocorseblack.jpg


Not a bad choice Si, could do worse that something along those lines,,,you guys keep safe for now, wont be too much happening for a few weeks until i get this wheel sorted and christmas over,,,then its all systems go again,,

[Johnnie5]

quote:Originally posted by slip

Bogeyman - it is that simple. Seriously. Anyone who does custom wheel orders can do that. Simmons, and a number of others.

4 x 100 is not fwd only. Older BMW's ran it, and I think some other older rwd cars too.

Any wheel guys that the classic/custom/race car guys use will do it for you no worries. I can get a list of places for you if you want.


old gemini's and vw's ran 4 x 100