What Do You Think? "sale of bike" on EBAY

[Fiend]

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/335178428352249.JPG


Hey guys I just sold my bike on ebay to a bloke in Sydney and I have been having some issues with the sale so I thought I'd give you all an input into what's gone down.

firstly the ad on E-Bay was :- Item number: 130263368920

The buyer brought it with Buy it Now and deposit money changed hands. He wanted me to leave the Vict plates on it so he could ride it around until july '09 before he had to transfer it. I told him that I didn't think that was safe and legal. I delivered the bike to a Melbourne depot and was waiting feedback.

This is the Email from him :-

Paul, i am very dissapointed, you cancelled rego,Lost patrs,Faring is craked,Tyre does not pass(most likely from burnouts),NO blinkers,NO horn,Torn seat, No tank key, Frame touched up. Way to many things to just forget.You have not told me any of it. NO mirrors, Exhaust doesnt pass, bike is filthy. Add says "passed roadworthy with no issues" & doesnt mention any faults. All correspondence will now be throug Ebay only. Previous correspondence kept and will be forwarded to Ebay if needed. You have 3 options: 1 refund me the amount of money it will cost to prepare bike for rego(~900$ quotes will be supplied) positive feed back. 2 reverse the deal, send me back my money get the bike back, neutral feedback. 3. Do nothing, i will do all i can to make Ebay help me reverse deal, very bad feedback. I bought this bike to ride not to run arround soursing parts and cheap labour. I will not charge for MY TIME. I paid you top dollar for the bike and hold you responsible. You have 24 hours to respond.

And I responded:-

I'm sorry that your disappointed with this bike but all the items/things that you have mentioned are not specified in the item description. What "you" wanted me to do with the Rego was illegal and I told you from the 1st contact that I was uneasy about it and would look into it and let you know. All the things you've mentioned cracks, no mirrors, no horn, worn tyres, loud exhaust etc where never listed in item description as not having or as factory. The word "STREETFIGHTER" pretty much say's stripped down hooligan bike, usually built from second-hand parts, crashed bikes, etc (look at the pictures). It's not a show bike and I didn't think anybody would think that it was with a Hammertone paint job out of a can. I rego'd and rode this bike about 5,000 Klm?s and have never had problems with it except for flat battery's which is now fixed.

I feel like I have done more than enough by waiting for the sale of your bike before getting money, driving the bike to Melbourne to save freight costs, posting the extra items at my expense and answering any questions honestly about this bike. I think you have "buyers regret" and want me to fix things up for you, which I'm not prepared to do. You can do what you like with E-Bay, as they will understand that I have not misled you or deceived you in any way. Negative feedback will only show that you didn't like the bike (your tastes) and that I'm not a bad seller as 1 bad feedback in 424 is to be expected. I didn't force you to buy this bike and If you where unsure you could've not brought it, or come and had a look at it. Go take it for a ride and relieve some tension. Good luck.

To which I was sent:-

I am sorry it had to come to this , i dont have "buyers regret", i love the bike. It will just cost me just under 10$ whitch i would never pay for this bike. I could have lived with no rego as i told you, i understood your point even though you risked nothing. I dont know who registers bikes in VIC but their requirements are sure different to those in Syd.(bull shit) Anyway you new that it was impossible to just register the bike as is, and that it will cost me a fortune and a hassle to register it. You are suppose to list your items bad points weather standard equipment or not. With feedback of 424 you should know that. Everything "you did" for me is realy not a big deal as i paid you top dollar for the bike, anyone including me would have done the same. And more. You know and i know you mislesd me and cheated me into the purchase. I would love to "Go take it for a ride and relieve some tension" but i cant, so fuck you! You will hear from me again and you will regret taking the position that you have. Good Luck.

SO WHAT DO YOU THINK? AM I AN ASSHOLE IS OR HE JUST KIDDING HIMSELF?

your thoughts either way are welcome....

[zx12argh]

You're an asshole [:p] but mate - caveat emptor. If the guy is buying a bike sight unseen from another state then he can't whinge about the condition. Thats why ebay give you the option to ask questions prior to the sale. Ebay will only crack the shits if your sale was fraudulent which it wasn't. He got the bike in the photos you supplied. Its his responsibility to make sure he was happy with the bike before he handed over the cash. He's just suffering buyers regret cause he didn't do his homework about registering a modified motorbike. Tell him to take some cement and harden the fuck up.

[oldskool]

He sounds like an up tight wanker who wants somthing for nothing, you never said it had a rwc nor that it was ready for one, just that it had had one in the past.
I think you will find Egay will not entertain it.

[sharky]

Difficult one mate....from experience as a seller I would say you left yourself open to some of the twats abuse.
I've read your ad and he's right, you didn't mention anything about worn tyre etc. If anything was broken/cracked/missing you should have said so...saves shit like this.
As for the 'passed a roadworthy in NSW and Victoria with no issues.' bit...you imply it would pass another test..reality is either it was a 'friendly' tester or like many of us it was passed then modded.

On the other hand if he had half a brain...and thats being generous.... he would know that tail set up and pipe would not pass...

I'm guessing he's the type that figured he could buy a streetfighter and immediately become 'one of us'......mmm Sound familiar anyone ?

[Shadowzone]

I reckon he's trying ti stiff you mate. I also reckon he should visit the "Well known Sydney Bike Builder" for a RWC.

Or maybe look for a friendly bloke who will sign it off as done like a champion homosexual on Oxford St.

Either way tell him to think of Chef's immortal song Chocolate Salty Balls if he has a problem...

[Deano]

unfortunately you have left yourself open to interpretation. you say 'streetfighter' as in crashed etc. what if he dosn't view it that way. after all how many 'factory streetfighters' are around. kinda like a generic name really.

personally if i had have brourght that bike as it was described i would expect something that WOULD pass a RWC. you make no mention of anything that is needed to make it pass

i would never buy the bike without asking plenty of quenstions and then i would find out all these problems from asking quenstion and therefore not purchase the bike in the first place.

but everyone is not like me thank god.

honestly he has a fair case and with the info given i would think you were a cunt too.

ebay might not give a shit but i believe a fair price for a fair product and would therefore be just as annoyed as him.

also your replies are very arrogant, no wonder he got his back up,

270kph hey - i would be questioning that first of all.

sorry for the honesty but you did ask for it

[Azrael]

Unless hes got you likethis..fuck him
http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/54410907485611.jpg

[fimpBIKES]

what a cunt

happy enough to ride around without rego, scum like that should be as per the photo above


its a USED vehicle, so a cracked fairing...
whatever
and the worn tyre, how many k's did u take to deliver it cos thats a pretty straight run sydney to melbourne

anyone who buys a used vehicle and expects it to be perfect (like this twat) is in their own lil dreamworld
and to be honest all the problems he has talked about were in the photos so fuckit

[chopaweeza]

I have to agree with Deano . He does have a case. You should have left the bike registered , asked him for a copy of his license details and filed a Transfer Of Ownership form with your local RTA . When selling a vehicle on Ebay you there is a bit of fine print about "Honest Description of the Condition" and he is building a case that you have breached that condition. If it is as he says then you are probably in strife.

We bought a late model Triumph for a clubmate last year from Victoria , the bike was described as registered & fully road legal and described as in great shape. The engine was filled with some product like Wynns Stop Smoke as the top end was knackered , the bike had clear evidence of hastily repaired crash damage , tyres were not legal and the overall condition of the bike was such that it would have needed another $3,000 to get it road ready & road legal. Plus , the guy cashed in the rego . He had the bike professionally inspected by a well known shop , paid for them to do a written inspection of the condition and took this to Ebay after a similar series of mails to what you have had . Faced with the written report , Ebay found in favour of the buyer and got the buyer to issue a full refund . The deal was reversed and the buyer is taking legal action against the seller to recover the transport , legal & inspection expenses .

If you buy something like this off Ebay get it inspected . If you are selling , be totally honest with the description and don't assume that people know what general terms mean .

[KATO ZX7]

Fiend, your alright mate.

What did this fella expect? Buying "sight un-seen" is just asking for trouble.
And leaving it registered? Is he completely stupid, i wouldnt let my own brother buy a bike of me and leave it rego'd in my name.

I dont think you've done anything wrong.

[fimpBIKES]

ive bought a few vehicles on ebay

the most recent a gsx250 the other week



i ALWAYS pick up, and take a copy of the items page with me
if it doesnt match up i walk

i'd say that this bloke had is chance to do that sort of a thing at the hand-over

but he couldve been going around bouncing off the limiter for the last few weeks for all u know
i wouldnt take it back

[Fight_fan]

Yeh it seems that this guy is a bit of a douche bag, but in saying that whilst u havnt been dishonest with him u havnt told him the full story either! Which is perfectly normal, I mean u wanna sell the thing... Still, I hope he lets it slide. I fear he may have a case too!

[TurboKat]

How did the bike pass a Vic RWC "with no issues" if it didn't have mirrors, indicators or a horn? That's the part that will hang you.
If you didn't have the tank key, you knew the tyre was bald, the seat was torn, etc, etc you should have listed that sort of thing in your ad or told him - deception by omission is still deception.
Caveat Emptor is all well & good & I agree that the buyer should have seen & ridden the bike especially considering its uniqueness & level of non standardness but he was probly assuming your 424 positive feedbacks meant that he could trust your description & that you wouldn't leave anything out.
You should have flatly refused to leave the plates on from the start so there was no confusion.
IMO the bike is still worth every cent of 7.5 but if I was in his position, I'd be paying you a visit to "discuss" it further.
My advice is that you accept some of the blame & come to a resolution whereby you contribute something towards rectification of the faults - say, half of the $900 he's talking about.
Karma is a very real concept.

[oldskool]

Daz you fuckin Hippy!

[Weaselman]

Ebay is buyer beware and there are positives and negitives with both arguments.

I agree that this fella is a twat and he didnt really grasp what a streetfighter was but i also agree there were to many things omitted from the description that may sway the deal in his favour.

[Cruisecontrol]

Fuck him.

Nowhere does it say "perfect condition" it merely states "used".
It is obvious from the photos that the pipe will not pass inspection and that is now his problem. So all he has to complain about is a rear tyre that needs replacing which could have been resolved with at least one question prior to the sale.

[Jockney Rebel]

sold as seen means just that..ive had pratts in the past try to back bikes and cars [ive sold and bought over 175 cars and about50 bikes since i was 19..] and i ALWaYS put S.A.S..on the reciept and i never pert with money unless ive seen the vehicle ..common sense really

[pt]

same as what evryone else has said. some things left out, but also he never fucking saw the bike before handing over cash. i think the thing here is that he is way too trusting. i would never buy a bike even from a dealer without seeing it and hearing it run.

and living in sydney, i would say this guy is some jacked up wanker who thinks he is hot shit and can shit all over you. to which i would say to him FUCK YOU.

just reverse the deal, get your bike back and tell him he's a WANKER.

[sharky]

In general EVERYTHING we buy off ebay is 'sight unseen'...we only have photo's of what we believe is the item and the buyers description...we trust it ...if we didn't ebay would not exist.
How many of you out there have bought summat from evilbay only to discover it is not all it seems...
Do you all then fall into the same category you are happy to put this buyer into ??
Only difference I see is its a bike this time instead of a stereo or bike parts......

[Cruisecontrol]

$7,500????!!!

Would you part with that without a decent look at what you are buying?

[pt]

quote:Originally posted by Cruisecontrol

$7,500????!!!

Would you part with that without a decent look at what you are buying?


fucking right on. if you can let that much go to chance then you either need to give me some of your excess cash or get your fucking head read.

[cutcat]

Every time I have bought something sight-unseen I have been dissapointed. It is simply the risk the buyer takes when they are too lazy or do not have the time or money to travel to the next state/country etc. It is known as "The penalty of convenience". Therefore the responsibility falls entirely on the buyer to satisfy his/her needs will be met prior to handing over money. Every persons expectations are different and this why photo imagery over the internet has been such a revelation however it will never replace a hands-on inspection.
In this day and age with speed cameras everywhere, leaving plates on a motor vehilce while someone else drives it is ludicrous. In fact it is illegal in Victoria when selling a vehicle without a Road-Worthy Certificate(RWC) to leave the plates on. How can this person say you have nothing to risk.
Your ad does not say nor imply the bike will be sold with registration or a RWC. Nor does it state that the bike is currently in a RW condition. By saying 'the bike has been RW in 2 states previously' also does not imply it is currently in RW condition. The pictures clearly show it is not. No mirrors being very obvious. When a motor vehicle is purchased without registration the purchaser takes on the responsibility of getting the vehicle to a RW condition. If(when buying sight-unseen) you had previously asked the seller "What does it need for RWC?" and they list 3 items but in fact you later find there are 6 items needing attention, would you contact the original owner for recompence? No, it was a subjective assessment done by an unauthorised individual. This information is used as a guide only. If the purchaser was intentionally misled then that is another matter. This is more of a case of missinterpretation of the information.
I think the buyer was naive to assume the bike was road ready. Clearly from the photos(provided in supersize) it needs mirrors, tail tidy mud flap, rear tyre looks low and anyone(I would have thought) would have guessed that exhaust wouldn't pass a RW test. I guess the buyer fell in love with the bikes aggressive styling and unique lines that his emotion to own it did overide other considerations that are now coming to light.
The fact that he threatened you in the last email now negates any responsibility you previously might have felt to help him out.
Your hands are clean.

[sharky]

Mmmmm Just had a thought...these tanks you're selling me Weaselman ????
Do they come with a warranty ??

[pt]

oh i missed the bit where he threatened you. changes my view entirely.


FUCK THE CUNT AND PISS ON HIS GRAVE. there is a point you can go to without being too much of an arsehole. this dude FUCKING MISSED IT BY A LONG WAY.

[Weaselman]

quote:Originally posted by sharky

Mmmmm Just had a thought...these tanks you're selling me Weaselman ????
Do they come with a warranty ??


Yup if your not satisfied you can go fuck yourself :D

[BillyWhizz888]

Tell him to sign up ;)

[Zbike]

your describtion was crap,
should have indicated damage and obvious things wrong with it.

if it were me selling id give him a few hundred of. But that would be before he threaten me.

[Shadowzone]

quote:Originally posted by sharky

In general EVERYTHING we buy off ebay is 'sight unseen'...we only have photo's of what we believe is the item and the buyers description...we trust it ...if we didn't ebay would not exist.
How many of you out there have bought summat from evilbay only to discover it is not all it seems...
Do you all then fall into the same category you are happy to put this buyer into ??
Only difference I see is its a bike this time instead of a stereo or bike parts......



I've never once complained when buying something and not getting what was described or ordered, I simply dont buy from them anymore.....

[chopaweeza]

Flip the coin for a second . Now , if Fiend was the person that had been rorted by this deal rather then the seller how many of you would be baying for the sellers blood ?

Deception by Omission is Still Deception .

Powerful words . Very true words . If something like this had happened to you how would you feel about it? How would you react ? Would it make you mad enough to crack the shits over it. If someone sold me a bike that turned out to be a lemon like this one were I would have to spend extra money on items like a tyre & other things to pass roadworthy when the bike has been sold in a "Will easily pass roadworthy inspection" I know what I would do to the seller .

Karma is a bitch . A major bitch . When it happens to you then you will understand .

[scotty]

I've read your add and the only thing I think I'd be pissed (at my self)at is the rear tyre look ok in the add, every thing else (if I wasen't going to look at it)is visable(crack an all). To get pissed that there is no mirrors and blah blah..Get Fucked cock ed

[Cruisecontrol]

quote:Originally posted by chopaweeza

Flip the coin for a second . Now , if Fiend was the person that had been rorted by this deal rather then the seller how many of you would be baying for the sellers blood ?




I would still say sucked in to the buyer for handing over the hard-earned without a decent look at it first. It is CDF.

[Fiend]

I guess the responses are split 50/50 which I was suprised at. Yes I have brought things off E-bay and when they have turned up were dissapointed but that's why you should ask questions. This guy rang me 10 or more times before he bid on it and asked me things like:- How loud is it (Very loud), what are the tyres like (close to the wear lines), does it have any issues (no key for petrol cap but a flat tool will open it) (mirrors aren't on but will srew into mounts) etc.. etc. He wanted to keep the rego on it because "he knew" it'll take him some time to get it roadworthy...

Anyhow thanks for your thoughts and in future I'll be more detailed with my descriptions. Interesting points of views...

[Weaselman]

well if he did call you or email you and ask all those things and you explained them then hes a cunt

[hooligan]

But only if theres a record of him asking those questions.

[sharky]

quote:well if he did call you or email you and ask all those things and you explained them then hes a cunt
Now you have explained THE WHOLE STORY I can agree with the above.....
You didn't tell us at the start of this thread that you had told him about the 'faults' on the phone...If you had, opinions might have been different..

[debaser]

I wouldn't buy a bike off any of you degenerate knob jockeys any how:D. He paid too much and didn't ask the right questions before buying a modified bike.:(

[_M_]

Well yeah my point of view has changed now that you've mention the phone calls, he's a toss.