R1 / FJ1200 hybrid idea

[sharky]

Been pondering this for a while...
I'll never have the 'spare' cash for a spondon type ali frame..
So next option..drop tuned fj motor into a modern chassis (like the kwak 750 triple in a KR1 years back).
First choice would be R1 (well gotta keep it Yam), or maybe FZR.
Then if it fitted, try to utilise the ram air system. Would have to make some sort of inlet manifold thingy to use the downdrafts but if it did work ..:D
Now I know there will be size issues but with a bit of 'creative' thinking it could be a real beasty....125+bhp, 80+lbs of grunt,a whiff of 'Eu de Nos' for good measure and a much lighter chassis.[}:)]
Yeah I know why not just get an R1....but thats the easy way...
Looking at Moog's GSX powered gsxr yesterday confirm my thoughts...anything is possible....and would certainly add the WTF factor.

[TurboKat]

quote:Originally posted by sharky

(like the kwak 750 triple in a KR1 years back).

That sounds [:p] Pics?

For [u]major</u> W.T.F. factor, why don't you put your XJR motor in a GSXR chassis, paint it green & put Honda stickers on the tank [?] [:o)]

[EFE 1230]

I think the best frame would be the FZR T model (88) it's got side spars that are square rather than the rounder sides of the 89 EXUP so would be easier to cut for clearance then plate to clear the FJ top end. I had an EXUP fighter with YZF750 usd f/e and fuck did it go! The FZR T models can be had rather cheap these days, around 3k for a clean jap import I reckon if you didn't want bodywork an importer could get one a lot cheaper.

[Weaselman]

quote:Originally posted by turbokat


quote:Originally posted by sharky

(like the kwak 750 triple in a KR1 years back).

That sounds [:p] Pics?

For [u]major</u> W.T.F. factor, why don't you put your XJR motor in a GSXR chassis, paint it green & put Honda stickers on the tank [?] [:o)]


Friggin right! I've never seen that done... Sorry to detract from the topic at hand but that bit spiked my intrest

[EFE 1230]

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/54132523020186.JPG
T model frame

[EFE 1230]

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/54132523024580.JPG
The first problem is the FZR topend is canted at a 45deg angle, FJ is straight up this may upset overall weight distribution (will wheelie good!!). If the FJ engine fits between the rails then you only need rear engine mounts/lower side rails that support the motor (not shown in 1st photo).

[sharky]

I see what you're saying mate. Found this pic on Google.
Compared to the R1's it should be relatively easy to fit.
New lower rail from headstock to lower rear mount...make it look stock...."It just fitted straight in Mr Inspector Sir [^]"

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/54132535428100.jpg


Time to find me a frame to look at....

[EFE 1230]

If you look at how the FZR motor sits in the frame and imagine the top end being upright like the FJ (bottom end is more or less the same)there in no way the FJ will fit without MAJOR surgery. The topend/carbs has to go right where the frame bends around and slants back to the swingarm pivot. You may have better luck putting the FJ in something like a watercooled GSXR1100 frame.A mate that straightens frames reckons the last 1100 frames are very solid compared to slabside/k/l models.

[sharky]

Been doing some playing....
Found out the clutch cover centre is the same size on both engines so using a pic of an FZR motor I scaled down an FJ to the same size.
It was a small pic so it was a bit blurry but it does the job.
I understand what your saying EFE but I was suprised by how little the difference looks to be.
I think it is gonna be close enough to investigate further.
I may have to use a fancy inlet manifold and the FZR carbs but it might just work....

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/54132571814273.jpg

[sharky]

Or what about a '94 ZX-9R frame ?

[Z Power]

Whatever frame you decide on it's going to be mono city the fj engine has heaps of grunt. Or if your really keen i have an r1z 250 i might part with now think of the wheelie's

[sharky]

The main aim is to get a lighter frame. The FZR thou comes in at 209kg, the Xjr is 232kg.
This is the main reason I was was looking at R1 frames but although lighter it just ain't gonna happen.
I've got an R1 rear wheel and s/arm to go in and I would use R1 stuff upfront so I should come in a fair bit lighter..add to that a sorted FJ motor and it should be fun...
I think I will have to trawl around some bike shops wiv me box brownie and tape measure...

[EFE 1230]

There's a bloke here in Adelaide who has a FJ1100 it's his ex 1983 racebike (Yamaha Pitmans) has (stock) braced frame/swingarm & FZR/T forks/wheels/brakes, big bore motor/flatside carbs,cams,head work and mate fuck does it go!!! The old steel frames can be set up for hard road riding so I wouldn't worry about changing the frame,if your heart is set on a FJ then go for it!! Use a FZR usd (longer than R1) fit the R1 arse end, stip it down and bingo! 1 very trick STREETFIGHTER.

[sharky]

I think we got our wires crossed mate...
I have had 3 12's and 2 11's. I now have an 11 in the xjr chassis.
I wanna do summat different and thought this could be fun to try.
Oh and the fj frames are crap to try to work with....huuge great wraparound beam frame.....make great anchors ;)

[Jockney Rebel]

sound s like u need summat REALLY wide ,, and it also sounds like a fukin pukka idea what about one of the the big bikes ? zx12r.blackbird, busa or would that defeat the object ?

[RUSS M8]

Now sharky, I don't see a reason why you can't lie the ol XJ engine down at an angle like the standard FZR engine? Just need some custom inkake manifolds and some downdraft style carbs to replace your carbs which are designed to be horizontal. :)

[sharky]

Not sure if you're takin the piss or not M8 ?
If I did I would have to look at the oil pick up point in the sump.
I plan to use downdrafts anyway if the motor fits to make use of the ram air and airbox set up (if poss).
See up there ^^^ how the motors compare...the arse end would be too high if I layed it forwards.;)

[Jockney Rebel]

slightly off topic but i reckon a tuned gt750 lump in a gixer frame would be a goer too btw Russ the fzr looks like a good start

[sharky]

Just joined up to a uk fzr forum...gonna pick their brains.

[RUSS M8]

Nah, not takin the piss.

Just make it fit! Can't be that hard! (ok, now i'm taking the piss)

[sharky]

Bit more photoshoping...
How this for close...

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/75024049832962.jpg

[fimpBIKES]

most of the modern twin spar frames have the main rails, then the forward engine mounts drop down on a welded on bit anyways

i'd get a frame wide enough, then grind off the forward mounts
get new ones machined up to suit and weld them on

the rear mount would be trickier i think cos thats normally a big through-bolt thing yeah? if u were lucky maybe that'd line itself up

[sharky]

Spot on Fimp. Thats why I am looking at the 87/88 FZR thou to start with. Almost the same bottom end and removable bolt-on rails from headstock to rear mount.

[fimpBIKES]

then find one and dooo it :D

[sharky]

You find me one and I will.
Still interested in the R1 frame as well Bear....
Not ruling anything out at this stage.:D

[fimpBIKES]

fuck knows how you would legally get it on the road though

individually constructed vehicle?
and dont tell em its a modified R1 chassis, just pretend like u did it all from scratch?

[fimpBIKES]

so if chassis numbers dont matter i would be looking on US ebay
those seppos crash all the fucking time LOL

[Bear]

In NSW you'd just need an RTA registered engineer to inspect it, I thinks?
QLD has always been tougher in that regard but a qualified engineer can get anything on the road, as long as he approves it and stamps it. ;)
Best to consult said engineer before you start actually cutting and welding and ask them what you need to do to get them to pass it ie. what sort of restructuring and the type of welding. I'm only speaking from 4wd modifying experience but it shouldn't be different with bikes, you'd think.

[fimpBIKES]

only difference is the aluminium welding involved
makes things a bit trickier?

i know with car engine swaps they have no problems passing a different engine when you have cut the old mounts of the front crossmember and welded new ones on, as long as the welds are neat

this is a bit more full-on though, cos the R1 engine is a stressed member
then again, im not sure how many auto-engineers would realise that...

i wouldnt bring it up unless they mentioned something :D

[sharky]

I'm going to speak to the Vehicle Mod's dept today to make sure there won't be any major issues.
I'm not sure if the R1 frame is going to work as the upper mount points are part of the main spar as opposed to say a gsxr thou which has welded on mounts.
ZX9R is also a possibility. Off to the wreckers later to have a look.

[sharky]

Just spoken to da man..:D
Basically no probs with engine swaps provided the new frame is able to handle the power. So as long as I go for a modern litre plus bike there should be no issues.
If there is any welding done to the frame they [u]may</u> want an engineer to inspect the welds..depends on the individual bike.
So the early Fzr may be a good option as the rail to be modded is removable.
But then again....[}:)]

[fimpBIKES]

yeah, an older frame from before they started making the sexy cast twin-spars is going to work best

would have thought that the first r1's would have had that style frame?

the ones on the tiller are definitely just whacked on there, maybe an SRAD gixxer frame?

[sharky]

Like this one..'98 frame.

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/51223408117064.jpg

[fimpBIKES]

bummer

http://www.streetfighters.com.au/forum/upload/51223433385485.jpg


the TLR style chassis would be a piece of piss

[sharky]

Well I think the guy at Brisbane wreckers is talking bollox....
According to him once a bike that is classed as a 'repairable write off' is bought by him it becomes a 'stat write off' and thus the frame is unable to be used again.
Also changing an engine in a bike to a different one becomes 'building a one off vehicle'.
So how come all the wreckers sell frames ?

I had to laugh when he declared there are only 2 licenced frame builders in the whole of Australia.........
Chopweeza and Pommy Chopper....any comment ?


Just emailed Qld Transport...lets see what they say.
Asked for a copy of the rules and regs too....

[fimpBIKES]

he's just too lazy to get them rebuilt, so probably organises to get the numbers taken off the repairable list

you can definitely do chassis mods to bike frames, my kat has an engineers certificate that says so!

just havent seen it done on an ally one


best to talk to the actually engineer that you are going to get to certify it
he is the one that ultimately you are going to need to keep happy

oh, and chop was saying something a while back about how you are allowed to be a "hobby" builder as long as you only do a few frames a year

[Issues]

dont know bout bikes but cars that are on repairable list if bought buy the wreckers they can get it put on the stat list to get the price down like $400 to $700