Self Designing/Building a shed

[fimpBIKES]

Hi folks,

Anne and i have just bought our first house, on a decent size block of land
big enough in-fact for a 12 x 7m shed of sorts

i have looked at what is on the market
and how much it will cost for what you get

i am seriously thinking about designing and building my own rather than buying a kit

probably using this sort of material
http://www.lysaght.com/files/dmfile/LysaghtZedCeesPart1Sep08.pdf
which i believe is what the garage companies use anyways

i could probably get a bit of a discount on the steel buying through annes work, and could save money by getting doors off ebay etc (there seem to be plenty on there for sub $200)

the shed place has quoted me $16 000 for the design they are offering me
i think i could do it for half that

anyone done this sort of thing?

any tips for getting it through council etc?

i'll get designing tonight, let you know what i come up with ;)

[80s freak]

Can't help with the shed thing, but congrats on the house mate.

[336LJ]

if its in the middle of no where. I'd build it and not even tell the council. thechnically they have no right to tell you what you can and can't build on your land, but thats another tin foil helmet story I'm not quite up to speed with.

IF/When we get our own patch of land I'll be doing something similar.
I have never seen a kit I like. but reckon if you can get a decent enough discount on the steel then making your own one will be easy as. and probably stronger. Unless you are as retarded as me, which is why I have mates who are builders.

Most sheds I have seen you wouldn't hang a block n tackle on without pulling the roof down. folded tin shit

[Large]

You going to do a concrete floor Conrad?

[JackTar]

Pretty sure you must lay a slab for something that size.

[Gix11]

Yea, you'd have to do a proper slab, and that's where the big dollars go.

[Macca2010]

Lots of things to consider when designing your own

Wind ratings are you living in a cyclone rated area etc?

Slab design and strenght using the correct ag rated concret, rio,dyno bolts etc?

Sometimes it safer and easier to use shed company they generally organise all the council bullshit as well and if the fucking thing fall down or the wind blows it away your insurance company will pay for a new one(if you have it insured)

Hope this helps good luck:D

[fimpBIKES]

thanks all, good stuff so far

i have a drawing in front of me that i got from a shed place's website
it is the same basic shape i want. it also details the slab that is required, so i would be happy to use that slab detail. proabably thicken it up a little while im there

the shed company has told me i would be up for about $85 a square meter for slab if i pay a contractor. luckily annes brother in law is a builder and im hopeful if i swing a few slabs (of the beer kind) his way he could assist in the concreting.
probably thicken it up a bit from the existing drawing too so i can a have lathe etc later

as far as cyclones go, im ok
i actually did the wind calcs etc for some switchrooms a few years back
so im pretty confident i can make sure it will be stable. if it needs to be signed off i can get some mates to do that who are civil engineers. but im being told most structures like this arent checked as long as they look ok to the council.

i WISH i was out somewhere in the middle of nowhere, but we have bought to a budget and so are in the middle of a regional town/city. so approval will be required. i had already started talking to the council to make sure i could build something prior to buying the place, and old-mate at the shed shop seemed to think i wouldnt have too much trouble getting it through council myself.


thanks for the input, like i said i'll knock up a drawing tonight and let you have a gander ;)

[Redmohawk]

Dude I've done 4 so far biggest was 6 by 10 M but all drawn up by me and council approved no shed has to have a slab but footings for posts for your one will need to be big (prob 400mm square by 600 deep) if you dont use a slab (cheeper to do footings first then pore slab into finished shed! as unless your putting stuff alot heavyer than a car slab only needs to be 100mm think then) steel for shed will be around the same cost as concrete for that size if you shop around. Council are usally very aprochable go see them FIRST and tell em what you want they will give you min specs for things like min spacing for roof purlins ex for different sizes (Ie max spacing distance is different for C100 perlin to C150) they will give you a photo copy of most stuff go home draw it up lots of measurements etc like the plan you have drop it in for them to have a quick look at it , ask for sujestion and take it home sort it. Then apply should pass ok then as they know who you are and they think they told you what to do (council love that lol)

[RevHead]

i built our own home ,,it was 17x11 metres in steel,i designed it ,then took it to YOUR LOCAL SHED MARKET, it cost me $500 for them to draw it up and get it engineered ,then the slab and the building to lock up cost $28,000,then it cost me another $50,000, to fit it out,dont go ranbuild there a bunch of fuck wits,,plus if its rural area 2a zoned you dont need to tell the council unless you plan to live in it, then its $1375 for the permit to live in ,when you build if you put rooms in it say 4 rooms tell them its a 2 room house ,with an office and a rumpas ,cause thats cheaper,if you say its got 4x bedrooms it,l cost you heaps more as they,l want a 50 metre long septic trench ,,its all bullshit but hey ive been through it hope this helps cheers ete

I suggest you do a 12 week owner builder course thru tafe,as council are much more forgiving to owner builders than licensed tradies.And you can just play dumb if anything gets picked on.

[fimpBIKES]

thanks red, the gal i need to talk to at the council is off until the 7th of june
so i plan to use that time to get a bit of a presentation together

damn pete, thats one serious bloody shed!
something else to mention in this case is that i have to make sure that this shed is definitely not a "dwelling". since this is a heritage area no new dwellings are to be built as part of the 30yr plan. also this means i have to have a roof pitch of 25-30degrees, and may have to wooden clad the walls of the shed

davo, dont think i want to take this risk
its only a small area and im sure something like this shed popping out of nowhere would be noticed. owner builders course might be worth the hassle though. shall see if there is a correspondence course i can do


i have knocked up a bit of a layout for you all to browse
based on this sort of a thing, which i know has been approved and erected in this area before
http://www.allgal.com.au/images/stories/general/89007.pdf

so here is my take on it, slightly less car-space and more skillion workshop. plus an extra meter of depth (7m)

http://www.asfphotos.com/upload/1274959673.jpg


http://www.asfphotos.com/upload/1274956912.jpg


not sure whether to use proper channels for the main structure or the thin folded sheet sort of ones the shed building companies go for

heaps less connections if i use a 100 parallel flange sort of beam i would imagine, those commercial sheds have hundreds of joints [XX(]

[336LJ]

at least its not being built at the front of the property.. has me fucked why the people that built this house put the shed half way down the driveway, and the door around facing the road where you can't see it..
Gotta love wire foot traps though.. hehe.. fuckers..

[RevHead]

nice design plety of room for all your gear ,remember fit it all out while uve got the cash messanene ,benchs etc

[Redmohawk]

Fimp WTF is 100 parallel flange ??? I assume you mean C section ???? in 100 mm ? The last shed i did, all structural steel was downgraded stuff for a steel merchant (ended up saving heaps) Changed shed design to suit what they had cheap (turned out they had a whole heap of 300mm C section cheaper than 100mm stuff as one side of the lip folded outwards instead of into the channel.

I welded it all together with the mig and a long lead instead of bolts and tech screws councel loved it lol best part is no pops and bangs in the shed from thermal expansion contraction , and shed is a extra bedroom/play room so is nice and quiet to sleep in.

[pappas]

Go onto your local council website and see the list of requirements needed to qualify for a complying development. I don't think a shed that size will comply but it's woth a look. If it does comply you can go straight to a Private Cerifier who can pass the plans in 10 days.
Also if you decide to go with structural steel you can work of a rough price guide of $5000/tonne installed. I've built a lot of both and IF i had the money I would use structural steel, but realistacally the folded C-section is a good product and very cheap in comparison.

Slab should cost around $4k if you do it yourself + excavation.

[fimpBIKES]

parallel flange = pfc = rolled "c" section
so yeah, the thick c channel stuff

there is this product available too, called LiteSteelBeam
http://www.litesteelbeam.com.au/litesteelbeamau/

it looks good, strong like a pfc but lighter (and therefore hopefully a lot cheaper)
im not sure how it goes with the cladding, but i might be able to clad straight too it without having to worry about too many top-hat type purlins

annes brother in law sounds keen to help with the slab, she thinks he might even be able to score a discount on materials cos he's a builder HURRAH

thanks pappas, i will have to drop into the local council
their website is pretty darn average!

336LJ, i know what you mean
i want to be able to work in the shed with the door open and not have to worry about people seeing all my treasures (or is that "trash"...)
its a good block isnt it, predates the boundary rules so the house is built right up near the front. no point wasting heaps of land with a front yard we'll never use :D
and there is already a fence and shrubs at the front to help keep the yard private

did i mention that we cant wait to STREETFIGHTER the inside of this cute little house ;)

[Hillsy]

I was looking at that litesteelbeam stuff when I was building the deck on the back of my place. The engineer said I could use 2 beams sandwiched together for a floor bearer over a 6m span. So, it's plenty strong.

I didn't go with though because it ended up being the same cost as running a middle post and using hardwood bearers. From memory, I think a 6m length of the stuff was around $600 - but that was the 300mm deep one, so I the roofing sized lengths should be cheaper.

[Zooks]

Posts cut from the scrub, 2nd hand 4x2, 2nd hand tin, mates around for a BBQ to lay the slab and erect the frame (different days) that's the way we do it in the bush mate. Lotsa beer, lotsa laughs and lotsa lies, good stuff. :)

It's not rocket science but it's bloody rewarding when you stand back and see it done.

[fimpBIKES]

update, i hate councils!!!

[Mishdog20]

They fair do love the cock... whats the issue? Overshadowing? Height? Heritage? Koala Overlay? Bushfire Overlay? the bloody list goes on.

[ALBI]

hey fimp urs and mine council take a cool $1000 just for application fee !!! then there is the slab !!concrete that is conrad nopt beer.

[ozzy1100]

fimp mate im a industral plumber and have to do steel work and sheeting as part of my job i looked at doing it all myself
to be honest it was such a pain in the arse that i went with a good kit and built it myself much and i must say much more easy
if you want it legal just my opp tho
one thing i will say is if u go tho kits know what they call their break pionts are eg there is fuck all in $ between 6mt wide and 7-7.5mt
then the price goes up because they then step up in steel size to span bigger
might i just add yr mock up looks great but would prob be the more $ to go because of the dif roof lines i would have a look at makeing the ridge
run at 90 deg to how you have it now and just have the doors in the same spot on the side u will prob find $ per sq mtr goes right down because all the spanes are at their
shortest so they can spec light steel for same streng .
when i priced mine out my 1st was a disign like yrs but then moved to one like i have(they just keep added bays spans stay the same)because for the same price i got a lot more sq mtrs. i ened up with 9 x 18 (162mts2) for just over the 17k mark kit form took dad and i under a week on and off to put up(btw work on 30% install rate form kit places) and all the legal shit was taken care off , we have acconts with bhp etc and we couldnt buy it any cheeper then the price, i worked one agaisnt the other (3 shed places)
there is fucking a lot more to it than that but brain fucked today

[StuNVA]

Have fun, mine was about the same size $22k all up, slab was about $12k. Neighbour objected and fucked me around for six months. I ended up getting the council dude down and said ok cunt where can i build this shed where you and the bitch next door cant complain. Then it was all plain sailing. I watched them put it up from my office window, I think anyone with half a clue could do it. They stood the frames up, clad the walls on the ground then stood them up, then done the roof, fitted the doors and were ready for a beer at 4o'clock.

[Large]

LOL @ 6 months Conrad.

[fimpBIKES]

just lots has happened

the biggest issue is cos of the heritage area
council took one look at my design (which i shaped like that so as not to interfere with the neighbours too much)
and said "nup"

the size was also an issue, my interpretation of the max 80sq.m floor area was wrong. apparently thats the total allowable roof area.
so straight away i ditched the carport, it'll still be for project vehicle storage but just not covered

new shape after a few more backwards and forwards's with the council is like this
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v676/fimpbikes/Shed02_110608.jpg

the hipped roof at the front is meant to make it blend with the front of the house
i talked them out of making me have hipped at the bike, so i get heaps of bike storage
also means i can run a main beam down the middle and a mezzanine storage area down near the cars
which means one of these will be the way to go, http://www.pacifichoists.com.au/hoisting/girder_trolley.htm + block & tackle

[Large]

Will those firetrucks have sirens?

[fimpBIKES]

the doors came to the front
mainly cos the driveway + turn around area just dominated the yard when we marked it out on the grass

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v676/fimpbikes/Yard02_110608.jpg

we have hedging and trees at the front so the view into the workshop isnt too exposed

the shed needs to be 4m from the rear boundary due to sewer lines
so the project storing area at the back stays, ive made sure that there is room to get up the side

bought a huge solid wooden door for the side off ebay for 20 bucks
looking at perhaps putting some opening up windows and benching like the they had at the pub at bathurst
that way the area will be nice and open for weekend workshopping, will make it less secure though...

[fimpBIKES]

sirens? sure why not :D

onto the kit situation
a kit isnt going to be worth it from our talks with a few companies

the cost goes up as soon as you say "heritage roof pitch", then when i mention that the walls will be horizontally clad wood (like the house)...
they dont do that, full stop
so the best they can do for us is a carport kit, which we can then fill the walls in
but the cost just for that is $7500, as a diy kit plus slab

then the council decided it needed a hipped roof, and that puts a kit right out of contention
they simply dont do that

so im designing the kit up myself our of 150PFC, and getting annes work to provide it
will weld up the corner joining brackets then it will all go together like a kit

the slab is only going to cost us material, about $4grand
hopefully get it all done in under $20k before the end of year

need to do fences first, which we are doing while we wait for council to officially approve things
big fuck-off fences so i can get a 4-legged security system in :D

[Large]

http://img4.uploadhouse.com/fileuploads/11332/11332085f215ae3329930e836b9023aa5cc2983f.jpg

AFR 2012 @ fimpbaby's!!!!!!!

[fimpBIKES]

why just one weekend a year? ;)

[Swordsy]

quote:Originally posted by Large

[img]http://img4.uploadhouse.com/fileuploads/11332/11332085f215ae3329930e836b9023aa5cc2983f.jpg[]

AFR 2012 @ fimpbaby's!!!!!!!


dibs on the lounge!

[fimpBIKES]

definitely have one in the mezzanine/lab ;)

[Snaffler]

http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/6042/slidequaker.jpg

[fimpBIKES]

[:O]

[Mishdog20]

Are ya missin a Balustrade on that second floor mate???

[ALBI]

hey fimp now i know why ur sig rang a bell !! just watched army of darkness and yelled out

Well, hello, Mister Fancypants. Well, I've got news for you, pal, you ain't leadin' but two things right now: Jack and shit... and Jack left town.

my kids looked at me like some kind of idiot!!

[fimpBIKES]

so this never happened, although i have found a solution...

move to a different fkn council and let the next poor bastard try to deal with em

[Mishdog20]

Shit that sucks mate, after all the work ya put in. Have ya got a shed at ya new place now?

[davo]

Underground shipping containers don't need council approval. Where in the Hunter are you these days Fimp?

[MONO]

Holy Funny as Fuck thread revival

[fimpBIKES]

good point Davo,

we are still in maitland for now but looking to move a bit further out
the new express way up to singleton makes the commute back in for work reasonable

and yep, the new place has a shed
BIGGER THAN THE FKN HOUSE!!!!!! sick of doing engine-work outside :S

[davo]

Good country out there mate,been a long time but I presume the NE Highway is now an expressway to Single town. Sounds like the AFR is definately at your joint next time.

[fimpBIKES]

i wouldnt say no....


new expressway finally opened a month or so ago
http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/roadprojects/projects/hunter_expressway/
trip down to eastern creek from new place will be quicker ;)