Todays no-shit-sherlock news story.

[HOS]

quote:Originally posted by NoZ

Ok.... so fear is fed to us via the media. They will make it seem like the end of the world - like bird flu, swineflu, terrorist threats, recession, jobless.... you name it, if it sells their rag, they will heighten the countries axiety with these over inflated stories.

It's propaganda. Look beyond the bullshit words and go on the street and see what it's really about. Has it affected people you know, places you live or are you basing your opinions on what you've read? Fair enough if you've got personal experience and i'm sure there is some truth in the hype. From my experience, the muslims I worked with lived in a shitty room in Bedford, worked 12+ hours a day for less than min wage and sent most of their money home to their wife and kids in Pakistan. They are not people that have come here to claim benefits or council houses, they are men trying to feed their starving families. However, there are many who do abuse our countries generosity and it's our own stupid governments fault for being so fucking politically correct. Perhaps we wouldn't be in such a financial crisis if they hadn't been giving 6 bed homes to immigrants etc etc etc.

HOS - I am shocked. An hour.. and you listened to it all? I reckon you secretly enjoyed it lol I went to my doctor for a blood pressure test, and what should have taken 5 mins, took 45mins cos he was bible bashing me! I changed my doctor after that and a few people have said the same. Anyways, make me a karhi mate - extra coriandor

He gave me a speshull Islam CD to take home wiv me []

Mines a balti chicken tikka with eggs served extra spicey..... Ahhhhh..... more dangerous than Corexit !! Oh ... and a table naan !

[HOS]

NoZ, how far are you from Wellingborough ?

Talking about curry, we found the most excellent pure vegetarian curry house Daft as it may sound, proper veggie curry houses are very rare.

This one is fukkin ace !! Gobsmacked at the food they make ! and it aint silly money either. []

[NoZ]

Wellingborough um not far enough? hahahahaha I'm about 40-50 miles away. I used to work as a driver for a curry place, ended up cooking most of it... lovely! [8D]

[Jup]

quote:Originally posted by HOS

JUP,

Fear is the most powerful control tool and a well used one.
People are intentionally held in a lack of knowledge and understanding because it generates fear.

The only thing people really fear is what they don`t know about.
Denial of knowledge to the population is the key to fear and control.
But my belief is there is nothing we are not capable of knowing.

Even the most complex ideas and concepts can be understood in simple terms aka Dr Steven Hawkins. ?

Interesting and true, but I think you're confusing what the catholic church did in the dark ages with what it means to actually know (the)God (of the bible).
Jesus never taught us to rule over one another, He taught us to serve each other. He never taught us to live in fear, He taught us to be joyful and free.

I love science because it reveals the wonder of creation, there is no commandment to be ignorant or fearfull, and I'm a huge fan of Dr. Hawkins too for the same reason: he delights in the wonder of the universe, and makes it easy to understand for simpletons like me.

We could spend/waste years discussing the evils committed by those charged to care for others, but it would be fruitless, and they will answer for their actions anyway. We could also spend/waste time covering the "wrath of God" in the old testament etc, but I'd rather live it, and show it (as Noz said) than just preach it.

I hadn't intended to get involved in the "my god's bigger than your god" side of this discussion, I'm only trying to address statements made that display a clear misunderstanding of the subject.

And I'd still love to see that data I requested, because nobody should be kept in ignorance of the truth.

[HOS]

The Truth is what eludes everyone on numerous fundamental issues.
If you want the truth it is far from religious versions of events and even further away from the orthodox scientific version of events Although there are elements of truth in each and every one.

The Catholic church is preparing itself for revelation of alien life (other intelligent species) in our universe. No doubt deep within the Anglican church they are preparing too.

Truth my mate, involves the understanding of the interaction of science, religion and alien life here on earth over thousands of years. That is the basis of truth and the denial of that knowledge is used to create [u]fear.</u>

[Large]

quote:Originally posted by Jup

quote:Originally posted by HOS

JUP,

Fear is the most powerful control tool and a well used one.
People are intentionally held in a lack of knowledge and understanding because it generates fear.

The only thing people really fear is what they don`t know about.
Denial of knowledge to the population is the key to fear and control.
But my belief is there is nothing we are not capable of knowing.

Even the most complex ideas and concepts can be understood in simple terms aka Dr Steven Hawkins. ?

Interesting and true, but I think you're confusing what the catholic church did in the dark ages with what it means to actually know (the)God (of the bible).

I wonder if in another 1 - 200 years we will be referred to as the dark ages because of what the dirty child fuckers in charge of the catholic church are still up to...?

quote:Jesus never taught us to rule over one another, He taught us to serve each other. He never taught us to live in fear, He taught us to be joyful and free.

lol yeah no fire and brimstone from this pulpit... When knowledge was scarce, the church used fear to control the population, yet now that anyone can acess the truth, the church pews are emptying....funny that.

Also a bit funny how they're fighting tooth and nail to stop ethics being teached in school as an option to religeon.

quote:I love science because it reveals the wonder of creation, there is no commandment to be ignorant or fearfull, and I'm a huge fan of Dr. Hawkins too for the same reason: he delights in the wonder of the universe, and makes it easy to understand for simpletons like me.

I love religeon because it's the ultimate fairytale combining elements of Jack and the Beanstalk, Pinocchio and Rumpelstiltskin with the tactics used by the type of companies that target their advertising for daytime tv and cold calling, while supporting thje ethics of snakeoil sellers like benny hinn.

quote:We could spend/waste years discussing the evils committed by those charged to care for others, but it would be fruitless, and they will answer for their actions anyway. We could also spend/waste time covering the "wrath of God" in the old testament etc, but I'd rather live it, and show it (as Noz said) than just preach it.

We need to spend years discussing the evils comitted by the cunts in charge of the church...because they are still happening...unless you are on the side of the nazi pope and his cronies and are prepared to deny everything?

quote:I hadn't intended to get involved in the "my god's bigger than your god" side of this discussion, I'm only trying to address statements made that display a clear misunderstanding of the subject.

Any god with the powers he is claimed to have...yet without the will to act against the cunts who use his name to further their agenda (in any form) is pretty much a waste of time. Maybe he should be demoted to a lessor god like one of the lower hindu deities...?

quote:And I'd still love to see that data I requested, because nobody should be kept in ignorance of the truth.

Like the church has being doing to it's adherants for a coupla thousand years or so...?

[NoZ]

Although harsh, Large is correct in his summary.

But I'd say that Jup follows his faith... and as I recently found out from an Anglican Vicar, he left the church because of it's not what it should be... it's become something truely dogmatic and bad. He still believes in the messages of christ and loves god but choses to expand his knowledge base with the nature based spiritual path. He misses being a vicar but loathes the church. I have to agree... I see the good behind the original messages have been used and corrupted to meet the churches own greed. And throughout history, they really have gone to town with controlling the masses with fear. I don't think there's a single decade in recorded history that hasn't got a horror story about the roman catholic church.

The pope is a hitler youth ffs! They've turned a blind eye to their priest systamatically raping kids; they reject contraception and therefore promote the evil of diseases such as aids... the church is fucked up, rich and corrupt to the core. But that is not to say that there aren't good people who follow that faith, who live their lives by the good of the messages taught by christ. They don't run the church, if they did, it wouldn't be so twisted.

I saw this program on nat geo about how they thought JC had faked his death, gone off to India and started Islam. They reckon they found the tomb with him and Mary Magdalane... that would be so cool if that was true. There's a fair few people who reckon he was druid-like too. But with the church controlling their version of history and the bible, we can only know what we are told.

Apply all of this to Islam and it's virtually the same. The xtremists in Ireland thought it and fought back. Terrorists often have fanatacal religious views. Be it Catholic v's Prosestant(Ireland); Church v's Islam (such as the crusades); Islam v's Hindus (very bloody battles in their own countries) or Islam extremists agains the evils of the west.... it's all bullshit reasons for bloodshed. Religion has been behind some of the most henious atrocities in history.... but people should have faith. They just shouldn't have dogmatic blind following of something inherently evil to the core. Suppose what I'm saying is stop being sheep. Stop believing every bullshit survey, story, report you read in our papers or what the gov/church tell you. Read between the lines and make YOUR own minds up to what really is going on.

[MTBEERWAH]

So what percentage of the population of the world actually witnessed these so called persons GOD & JESUS? and when was the first cut of the bible actually written?
I don`t mind watching the odd doco on SBS & ABC, correct me if i`m wrong as i basically no nothing about the subject as i`m not a devotee to the cause, but after watching one particular doco on the subject of the good book, it was said the book,bible if you will, was not written until about 100AD,and until that point,it was all hand me down information from stories around the table after a good meal. Now 100AD hey(If thats true), you no what its like if you get 20 people in a room, and tell 1 person a story,and pass it on,so on and so forth,when it gets back to old mate who stated the story, its way off key.
So once again, how many people actally witnessed this so called event which has convinced the world and changed peoples lives to believe in this event?

[nick76]

Im not for religion. Alot of my family,and earlier generations were taken away through religous bs.
People can think whatever they want. I don't care. I just hate it when people try and force it apon me.

As for MTBEERWAHS comment,who did actually witness this?? The book couldve been written on chinese whispers.

I've upset more than my fair share of churchies, by saying, who the fuck can feed 2000 people with a couple of fish and a few loaves of bread, or whatever it was he did.
I tell them God/Jesus was just way ahead of his time,maybe he was the David Coperfield of 2000yrs ago!!!
I don't think they like that,but im only taking the piss,maybe....

[HOS]

[HOS]

I`m wearing one of my favourite T-shirts today

St George flag on the front and these words written across the flag:

IF YOU DON`T
LIKE MY LAWS AND
MY CUSTOMS
GET THE FUCK
OUT OF MY
COUNTRY.

http://farcanal.biz/catalog/

[NoZ]

Bible was written 70 years after JC died. It was started off by a certified nutjob (no he really was mad). It was rewritten by monks, translated from one language to another and it is said they were tripping their nuts off on mouldy bread, bad lighting and mis-translated loads of it. It was then rewritten by King James, which is the current version.

I think the film Dogma nailed it really.

[Jup]

The only bit worthy of addressing:

quote:Originally posted by Large

quote:Jesus never taught us to rule over one another, He taught us to serve each other. He never taught us to live in fear, He taught us to be joyful and free.

lol yeah no fire and brimstone from this pulpit... When knowledge was scarce, the church used fear to control the population, yet now that anyone can acess the truth, the church pews are emptying....funny that.

Also a bit funny how they're fighting tooth and nail to stop ethics being teached in school as an option to religeon.

1: Not my pulpit. I'm not preaching here, and I'm going to great lengths to be respectful of averyone elses beliefs, including those without them. I challenge you to find one member that I have approached with the purpose of preaching at them


In fact I respect that the pagans/buddhists/athiests have chosen what makes sense to them, and have had the courage to stand by it, it's all I've done. You wouldn't want me to be a hypocrite would you?[


2: The organised religions pews are emptying because their congregation can now freely access the information for themselves, you're absolutely right. But they're now filling the pews of the smaller churches who have stuck to the true message - and those congregations are experiencing massive growth. Funny that.

3: "Religious education" is already an optional class in most schools, and as far as I'm aware an "ethics" class would be welcomed as every christian I know believes that the place for religious education is either at home or in church.



I'm not here trying to convince anyone that any particular (a)theism is right or wrong, I'm only calling bullshit on "facts" that have been presented on page 1 of this thread.

As to "when was the bible written", NoZ almost has it right. The gospels written by the apostles themselves date to no later than 30-40 years after Jesus death, also Pauls letters. The confusion is in the dating. I'm sure Noz's research led him to find the books written about 60-70A.D. but "A.D." doesn't begin at Jesus death, Jesus was actually about 6 years old at 1 A.D. It's an understandable mistake.

Can we kick someone else now? Anyone who really wants to discuss my faith is welcome to join the christian forum where I am a member and we can stop boring all these nice people. Either way, unless someone wants to answer my simple questions about the "facts" persented earlier, I'm done.

[Cruisecontrol]

Kudos mate.
I may not agree with your faith but I can't help but admire your ability to defend it without an ounce of animosity.

[Large]

Science takes man to the moon.

Religion flies planes into buildings.

[NoZ]

Yeah, definitely kudos Jup. No, please don't be a hypocrite, I hate hypocrites - which is why I left the church as a child.

I watched a series on tv about the bible and this black guy called Mark, who was a theologan and someone who studied it, went to the places where the apostle wrote the first gospels and he said it was 70 years after JC had died. I questioned it because of the life expectancy of people in those days and also the guy was nuts. Alot of those gospels were written as speculation of 2nd/3rd hand accounts. Either way, it's a collection of stories and moral lessons to follow. It's your book and I won't diss your right to take from it what you will. It's not much different to the celtic mythology that I enjoy reading. It was written at the time and then translated and rewritten by the church. So it's been twisted to what they wanted you to read, rather than the savages lol.

This is why my dad says not to talk about football, religion or politics in pubs... and this is like a pub. Lets not fall out over something that didn't matter last week. You can be a born again xtian and have a wicked fighter and be a hooligan when you're not in church... does it matter? Not in my book !

[HOS]

quote:Originally posted by NoZ

Bible was written 70 years after JC died. It was started off by a certified nutjob (no he really was mad). It was rewritten by monks, translated from one language to another and it is said they were tripping their nuts off on mouldy bread, bad lighting and mis-translated loads of it. It was then rewritten by King James, which is the current version.

I think the film Dogma nailed it really.

That about sums Christianity up.

A pile of random events that may or may not have happened, bull`d up and sexed up and then cobbled together to form a system of power and control aka Christianity and its Bible.

As you say its been rewritten so many times to update its control base to fit more modern times.

Thats why the "Crown" took over the Church hundreds of years ago, they saw it as a great tool for control to have in its royal hands.

The Bible is such a bad "cut and paste" job, its a complete nonsensical mess.

[HOS]

The pews are emptying in the UK for no more simple a reason than people have been turning their back on the Chritsian Church for decades.

People are sick to death of religion whichever badge of office. That is what this thread is all about.

Anglican church is ripping its guts out over ordination of female clergy. That arcane view towards women is utter bollox [xx(]

Male domination of Religion, Government, Freemasons, financial institutions, etc.... work it out.

The Catholic Church, another branch of Christianity is about as Christian as my fucking arse after 12 pints of Stella and a chicken Phall !

[NoZ]

Like I said, the guy I know who is a vicar is anti-church but not anti-xtian - he still loves his faith. It's the church, not the faith that is the problem, well in the church of england one anyway. Roman Catholic church is very different and just beyond comprehension to me... RC is the original church of Christ Hos you doofus lol... but you are right - they lost the way centuries ago. Actually JC was a jew. The new faith used to hide and leave fish symbols in the sand and get thrown the lions if they got caught. Then they grew and grew and tried to take over the world. Which is what you think islam is doing... so why is it good for the church but not islam? Both derive from the same part of the world ffs... JC wasn't white with blonde hair and blue eyes! He was a raghead...! His followers went out into the world and tried to convert the masses - and succeeded. The vikings converted to xtianity to help with trade... so fast forward a thousand years and here we are.

Every single country has been invaded and influenced by the new blood. When the national dish of the Uk is a chicken tikka masala (which doesn't exist in real indian cooking) then the transition has already happened. On the otherside of the coin - would any of you do the jobs that these illegals do for the money they get paid? Or do you just enjoy the food when it turns up when you've ordered it?

Nailed it there HOS - male domination of a religion = power. Oh and history is a pile of random events...and that's been rewritten many times to suit those in power. Why should a holy book be any different? what is the truth? only how you perceive it to be right?

[TurboKat]

Let us praise God...